Hilbert's Hotel

Diskussionsforum zur Unendlichkeit: Theismus, Atheismus, Primzahlen, Unsterblichkeit, das Universum...
Discussing Infinity: theism and atheism, prime numbers, immortality, cosmology, philosophy...

Gamestudio Links
Zorro Links
Newest Posts
lookback setting performance issue
by 7th_zorro. 04/16/24 03:08
folder management functions
by 7th_zorro. 04/15/24 10:10
zorro 64bit command line support
by 7th_zorro. 04/15/24 09:36
Zorro FIX plugin - Experimental
by flink. 04/14/24 07:48
Zorro FIX plugin - Experimental
by flink. 04/14/24 07:46
LPDIRECT3DCUBETEXTUR
E9

by Ayumi. 04/12/24 11:00
Sam Foster Sound | Experienced Game Composer for Hire
by titanicpiano14. 04/11/24 14:56
SGT_FW
by Aku_Aku. 04/10/24 16:09
AUM Magazine
Latest Screens
The Bible Game
A psychological thriller game
SHADOW (2014)
DEAD TASTE
Who's Online Now
2 registered members (7th_zorro, Quad), 373 guests, and 3 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
11honza11, ccorrea, sakolin, rajesh7827, juergen_wue
19045 Registered Users
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rating: 2
Page 29 of 67 1 2 27 28 29 30 31 66 67
Re: Q: Should creationism be taught in shools? -- A: YES! [Re: smitty] #240789
12/12/08 16:34
12/12/08 16:34
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 868
Chicago, IL
Dooley Offline
User
Dooley  Offline
User

Joined: May 2005
Posts: 868
Chicago, IL
Originally Posted By: smitty
Dooley,
I thought you may find this site interesting. It is a former PLO terrorist.
http://www.shoebat.com/


Huh? Creationism in schools Smitty...

Re: Q: Should creationism be taught in shools? -- A: YES! [Re: Dooley] #240791
12/12/08 16:43
12/12/08 16:43
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 2,043
Germany
Lukas Offline

Programmer
Lukas  Offline

Programmer

Joined: May 2007
Posts: 2,043
Germany
Originally Posted By: Dooley
Lukas, your argument about God's opinion changing is invalid. Let me explain. You stated that if we assume God created the universe and its laws, then they should be perfect. Therefor there would be no reason for God to interfere with events on Earth, like answering prayers, performing miracles etc...

However, this argument assumes that we know God's intention behind creating the universe. It assumes that He was trying to create some machine which works perfectly. It's actually taking materialistic philosophy and applying it to God.


I did not claim that I know what god wanted to create (if he exists), I just sayd that god knew what he wanted when he created the universe and create it and the natural laws just as he wishes. If he influences later, that means he changed his opinion! As one of the two opinions must be unperfect, god can't be perfect!
Btw god revoked quite much stuff in the new testament, which means that he must have changed his opinion. As god is perfect, and changing his opinion means that he is not perfect, god can't exist. quod erat demonstrandum.

Re: Q: Should creationism be taught in shools? -- A: YES! [Re: smitty] #240792
12/12/08 16:46
12/12/08 16:46
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 2,043
Germany
Lukas Offline

Programmer
Lukas  Offline

Programmer

Joined: May 2007
Posts: 2,043
Germany
Originally Posted By: smitty
I got bored with that video after a couple of minutes.

That means you didn't watch all of it?

Re: Q: Should creationism be taught in shools? -- A: YES! [Re: Dooley] #240795
12/12/08 17:09
12/12/08 17:09
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 178
S
smitty Offline
Member
smitty  Offline
Member
S

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 178
I know, Dooley. I just thought you may find it interesting since you are Muslim.

Re: Q: Should creationism be taught in shools? -- A: YES! [Re: Lukas] #240796
12/12/08 17:10
12/12/08 17:10
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 178
S
smitty Offline
Member
smitty  Offline
Member
S

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 178
Lukas, if you knew the Lord, then you would know that all what you said is not true. smile

Re: Q: Should creationism be taught in shools? -- A: YES! [Re: Lukas] #240797
12/12/08 17:11
12/12/08 17:11
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 178
S
smitty Offline
Member
smitty  Offline
Member
S

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 178
No, Lukas, I thought the video was stupid.

Re: Q: Should creationism be taught in shools? -- A: YES! [Re: Dooley] #240799
12/12/08 17:20
12/12/08 17:20
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 178
S
smitty Offline
Member
smitty  Offline
Member
S

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 178
Actually it is all related. If the bible is true (which it is), then creationism is true and it should be taught in schools smile

Re: Q: Should creationism be taught in shools? -- A: YES! [Re: smitty] #240801
12/12/08 17:26
12/12/08 17:26
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 2,043
Germany
Lukas Offline

Programmer
Lukas  Offline

Programmer

Joined: May 2007
Posts: 2,043
Germany
Originally Posted By: smitty
Lukas, if you knew the Lord, then you would know that all what you said is not true. smile

If you knew that the lord doesn't exist, then you would know that all what you said is not true.

Did you actually understand what I said? Did you listen to me? Can you disprove what I said?


Originally Posted By: smitty
No, Lukas, I thought the video was stupid.

It is not stupid. Watch the whole video!


Originally Posted By: smitty
Actually it is all related. If the bible is true (which it is), then creationism is true and it should be taught in schools smile

Creationism is not true! It's just religion! It's disproven! God does not exist and Evolution is true!




Re: Q: Should creationism be taught in shools? -- A: YES! [Re: Lukas] #240805
12/12/08 18:13
12/12/08 18:13
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 868
Chicago, IL
Dooley Offline
User
Dooley  Offline
User

Joined: May 2005
Posts: 868
Chicago, IL
Originally Posted By: Lukas
If he influences later, that means he changed his opinion! As one of the two opinions must be unperfect, god can't be perfect!
Btw god revoked quite much stuff in the new testament, which means that he must have changed his opinion. As god is perfect, and changing his opinion means that he is not perfect, god can't exist. quod erat demonstrandum.


But that's just it. How do you know that God didn't intend to create a changing, evolving universe? The Universe changes and evolves, people change and evolve, so God's law sometimes changes and evolves. Any religious person will agree to this. As a Muslim, I believe the central belief of One God, and following His Commandments never changes. The specific laws might change or evolve, but the belief never changes.

Paul's Christianity however, does present a major change in belief from that of the Old Testament, and even that of Jesus and his desciples. They even argue about it in the Bible, and call each other hypocrites. This is a problem for Christians to resolve.

Getting back to the question at hand, all I'm arguing is that since it remains impossible to prove or disprove the existence of God, it is still a viable explanation for the existence of the universe, the beginning of life, and the mechanism of evolution, and should not be ignored.

OK Smitty, I'll bite. I'm no expert on history or Palestinian/Israeli relations. However I know that creating a refugee situation is no way to solve a refugee situation. That's exactly what happened. Now everyone is surprised that Palestinians want to have their homes back. I'm not saying I agree with everything every Palestinian has done in the past, a lot of their actions have clearly contradicted Islamic teachings, but I do notice that while specific methods of Palestinians are highlighted a lot in the media (i.e. suicide bombings, rocket attacks etc...), some equally horrible things are also done by the Israelis (i.e bulldozing people's homes while they are still inside, shooting at and killing school children, preventing water and medical supplies from reaching whole communities etc...).

As for hating Jews, this is not a teaching of Islam

"They are not all alike. Of the People of the Scripture (i.e. Jews and Christians) there is a staunch community who recite the revelations of Allah in the night season, falling prostrate (before Him). They believe in Allah and the Last Day, and enjoin right conduct and forbid indecency, and vie one with another in good works. They are of the righteous." (Quran 3:113-114)

The Quran recognizes goodness and righteousness wherever it is. This is not an endorsement of every Christian and Jewish practice, many are condemned in the the Quran, like taking Jesus as a god etc...

As for those who would argue that religion is just a means of controlling the masses, actually this is a human practice, not a religious practice. Yes, religions are used to control people, but so are secularist ideas, communist ideas, nationalist ideas etc... Greedy, power hungry people come from every nation, and they will use whatever means they can to gain authority, including religion. But that does not change the teaching of the religion.

"Lo! Allah enjoineth justice and kindness, and giving to kinsfolk, and forbiddeth lewdness and abomination and wickedness. He
exhorteth you in order that ye may take heed."
(Quran 16:90)

The people who do injustice will be judged all the more harshly for their manipulation of religious ideas. But still, this does not effect whether belief in a Creator is scientific or not. Hitler used Darwinist ideas to justify the slaughter of millions of Jews. Should we forbid evolution to be taught because of the actions of Hitler? Once again, to restate my point of view, while creationism as taught in the Bible is unscientific, and should be kept in a religious studies or social studies class, the idea of intelligent design is perfectly logical, and presents no threat to science. The real threat to science is the practice of closing the door on ideas, and areas of study, as many evolutionists have tried to do with intelligent design.

Re: Q: Should creationism be taught in shools? -- A: YES! [Re: Lukas] #240806
12/12/08 18:28
12/12/08 18:28
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 178
S
smitty Offline
Member
smitty  Offline
Member
S

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 178
Ah, but I do know that the Lord does exist and that He is truth and His word is truth. Yes, I understood what you said, Lukas. smile No, I cannot disprove what you said anymore than you can disprove God and His word (the bible). smile I thought the video was stupid. I did not need to watch anymore. Creationism IS true. It is not a religion. It is NOT disproven. smile God DOES exist and evolution is not proven and false. smile

Page 29 of 67 1 2 27 28 29 30 31 66 67

Moderated by  jcl, Lukas, old_bill, Spirit 

Kompaktes W�rterbuch des UnendlichenCompact Dictionary of the Infinite


Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.1