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Re: Q: Should creationism be taught in shools? -- A: YES! [Re: HyperGraph] #240357
12/10/08 16:09
12/10/08 16:09
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,205
Greece
LarryLaffer Offline
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LarryLaffer  Offline
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Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,205
Greece
Dooley, thanks for the encouragement. My posts take a lot of time to write so it's nice to know that at least one person is reading them. From now on I'll be putting a tl;dr (too long; didn't read) statement under all of my posts, for all the other readers out there who are suffering from ADD smile

Just to clear my stance to all of this (again), I want to say the following. Only a fool can say in certainty if there's a God or not. We may attempt to explain the aftermath of Big Bang and how humans and everything else has evolved to their current state, but no scientist has the answer to what initiated the Big Bang. We do however have evidence that explain to a certain extend what happened from Big Bang until today, but none to claim if there's a God or not.

Also,

Originally Posted By: Dooley
A cell is millions of times more complex that a watch, is there any logic in assuming that it formed randomly?


I'll try to explain this one more time.. Natural Selection is not random. Meaning, the selection to which generations are allowed to breed and which die are nothing but random. The only thing random is how alterations are made to each generation. Also, and this is also a big misconception about evolution, the effects of evolution apply to both living and non-living things. Which means that the complexity of the first living cell should come as no surprise since it was also evolved from non-living things to the state of evolving certain attributes that would classify it as a living organism, such as the ability to re-produce and the ability to metabolize. It's just that the attributes of life allowed some things to survive through time better than non-living things. Also, the "laws" of natural selection were not designed themselves but they are simply derivations of the laws of physics. Now you may ask, well who designed these laws of physics then? Scientists have long tried to unify all four forces of physics into one and I think that eventually they'll succeed..

To make this even clearer, check this out:

Let's say I write a function in Lite-C about a super AI for an FPS game..

Code:
function SuperAi()
{
do_crazy_AI_stuff();
do_more_crazy_Ai_stuff();
more_AI_stuff_that_need_randomness(random(10));
final_AI_stuff();
}


as you can see, I do use randomness for my AI, but that's hardly the whole thing for how my ai works. Same principle works for Natural Selection. It's greatness revolves around several NE laws which in turn get derived from physics, but randomness is only a small part of it.

Hope it makes sense..


tl;dr maybe there's God, Natural Selection not random


Cheers,
Aris


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Re: Q: Should creationism be taught in shools? -- A: YES! [Re: HyperGraph] #240362
12/10/08 16:31
12/10/08 16:31
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 8,177
Netherlands
PHeMoX Offline
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PHeMoX  Offline
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Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 8,177
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Originally Posted By: HyperGraph
Quote:
I will say it again. Where do you think the laws in the USA came from? The bible.


Certainly the Bible was referenced for law, as were other documents. But the Bible is not the basis for US law. For example, we don't have laws ordering the execution by stoning of disobedient children, adulterous women or homosexuals. Yet these are biblical laws, correct? We also do not have laws that demand the worship of God, forbidding the making of idols and keeping the Sabbath, right? And yet these are a part of the 10 commandments? I don't believe that we have laws against coveting, either. So what are we left with? Don't steel, don't bear false witness ... but are these really "biblical"laws? Aren't they laws that are "common sense" that are found in just about every country on the planet and have been in most civilizations throughout history? So what of our laws is "biblical"?

Again, the Bible was certainly referenced. Yes, many in the early stages of the USA were from a variety of Christian denominations (Quaker, Baptist, etc). But many of the Founding Fathers were deists and this is well substantiated.


Totally wrong, the US constitution is NOT based on the Bible;

http://atheism.about.com/od/godlessliberals/p/Constitution.htm

From the article:

Why does the Christian Right seek to make a big deal out of the religious beliefs of the authors of the Constitution, though? They seem to think that if these men can be identified as devout Christians, then it follows that the Constitution is a Christian document which embodies Christian principles and doctrines (as defined by the Christian Right, of course). This does not follow, however. A Christian is every bit as capable of creating a godless, secular document as an atheist is.

Indeed, the fact that many of these men were devout Christians (even if not in the way that the Christian Right imagines) bolsters the case of contemporary secularists because it makes the absence of overt religious and Christian language all the more glaring. If they had mostly been atheists, the non-religious language would be expected and unremarkable. Yet because they were religious and steeped in Christian education, the absence of Christian language and references must be read as both deliberate and purposeful.


Cheers


PHeMoX, Innervision Software (c) 1995-2008

For more info visit: Innervision Software
Re: Q: Should creationism be taught in shools? -- A: YES! [Re: HyperGraph] #240364
12/10/08 16:41
12/10/08 16:41
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 178
S
smitty Offline
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smitty  Offline
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S

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 178
HyperGraph, are you Dan Silverman?

Re: Q: Should creationism be taught in shools? -- A: YES! [Re: smitty] #240383
12/10/08 18:21
12/10/08 18:21
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 19
State of Mind
H
HyperGraph Offline
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HyperGraph  Offline
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H

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 19
State of Mind
Any reason you ask? I am getting my feet wet with gamestudio and don't have any way to contribute yet. Wanted to post in the morbius thread to introduce myself, but for some reason I cannot find the new post button there. I found this thread and thought it was interesting, though.

Re: Q: Should creationism be taught in shools? -- A: YES! [Re: HyperGraph] #240389
12/10/08 18:42
12/10/08 18:42
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 178
S
smitty Offline
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smitty  Offline
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S

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 178
You sound like Dan Silverman. Are you he?

Re: Q: Should creationism be taught in shools? -- A: YES! [Re: smitty] #240391
12/10/08 18:50
12/10/08 18:50
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 19
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H
HyperGraph Offline
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HyperGraph  Offline
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H

Joined: Dec 2008
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Nope. Not he. smile How can I sound like someone by typing? Do ya got a mic in my room? Just kidding wink .

Re: Q: Should creationism be taught in shools? -- A: YES! [Re: HyperGraph] #240392
12/10/08 19:12
12/10/08 19:12
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 178
S
smitty Offline
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smitty  Offline
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S

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Posts: 178
HyperGraph,

Your style of writing and your way of replying and answering are very similar to that of Dan Silverman's from what I have seen. Do you know him?

Quote:
How can I sound like someone by typing? Do ya got a mic in my room?


maybe smile

Re: Q: Should creationism be taught in shools? -- A: YES! [Re: smitty] #240398
12/10/08 19:28
12/10/08 19:28
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 19
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H
HyperGraph Offline
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HyperGraph  Offline
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H

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 19
State of Mind
Quote:
Your style of writing and your way of replying and answering are very similar to that of Dan Silverman's from what I have seen. Do you know him?


Cool! Nope. Should I?

Quote:
maybe


Yikes! I'd better watch what I say then? No camera, though, right? :P

Re: Q: Should creationism be taught in shools? -- A: YES! [Re: HyperGraph] #240409
12/10/08 20:25
12/10/08 20:25
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 178
S
smitty Offline
Member
smitty  Offline
Member
S

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 178
Quote:
Cool! Nope. Should I?

I don't know. Should you? smile

Quote:
Yikes! I'd better watch what I say then?

not a bad idea smile

Quote:
No camera, though, right?

smile

Re: Q: Should creationism be taught in shools? -- A: YES! [Re: smitty] #240411
12/10/08 20:33
12/10/08 20:33
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 19
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H
HyperGraph Offline
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HyperGraph  Offline
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H

Joined: Dec 2008
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Uhm ... O ... K ... Bit strange ...

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