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Re: Science and Creation
[Re: Ran Man]
#68841
04/03/06 19:56
04/03/06 19:56
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 51
Neonotso
Junior Member
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Junior Member
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 51
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Quote:
 I want my third star back again man!
I lost my 3rd star too. I tried boosting your rating up, but you have so many votes, it didn't go up. 
...I want to see that thing you've been working on Irish_Farmer. 
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Re: Science and Creation
[Re: Matt_Aufderheide]
#68842
04/03/06 19:59
04/03/06 19:59
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Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 3,682
Coppell, Texas
Ran Man
Expert
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Expert
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 3,682
Coppell, Texas
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Please consider and EXPLAIN the following below! I want the reasons for the exact seasons that we experience here on earth! Please explain... Quote:
EARTH'S TILT AND ROTATION
The earth's axis of rotation is tilted 231/2 degrees relative to the perpendicular of the earth's plane of orbit. This tilt causes the four seasons. During the months of May, June, and July the northern hemisphere is pointed toward the sun, causing the hemisphere to warm and bringing on the season called summer. During November, December, and January the northern hemisphere is pointed away from the sun providing colder temperatures and the season called winter. Why is this tilt 231/2 degrees? Why not some other value?
What if the earth had no tilt, and the axis of rotation remained perpendicular to the plane of orbit? We would have no seasons and the surface temperature at any point on the earth would be the same during both July and January. The equatorial region of our planet would be intolerably hot all year and the poles would remain fairly cold. Ice would accumulate at the poles. The weather patterns would be stationary with permanently positioned warm and cold air masses. Some areas would continually be very humid while other areas would be quite arid. Only the mid-latitudes would be comfortable for human habitation and suitable for cultivation. Only about one half of our presently farmable lands could grow crops.
What would be the effect if the earth had double the present tilt? Temperature extremes between seasons would be much more pronounced. Even the mid-latitudes would have unbearable heat in the summer and frigid cold in the winter. Most of Europe and North America would experience very prolonged darkness in the winter and very prolonged daylight in the summer. Life on most of the earth's surface would become intolerable.
http://www.icr.org/index.php?module=articles&action=view&ID=61
If the earth did not have this exact tilt, then life would be very bad for us all. So, why is this happening? Please explain?
@neonotso
I gave you 5 stars buddy. lol 
Last edited by Ran Man; 04/03/06 20:02.
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Re: Science and Creation
[Re: Matt_Aufderheide]
#68843
04/03/06 20:03
04/03/06 20:03
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Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 202
Southern California, USA
GhostwriterDoF
Member
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Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 202
Southern California, USA
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Heya Ran Man, I somehow have 2 stars, you can have one of mine @William, remember that a population needs a stable food source to sustain a population. Early peoples were nomadic partly because they went were the food was seasonally. Consider also that life was difficult, often dangerous and uncertain for those early nomads. Their lives were short. There is even genetic evidence that mankind was reduced in population to a mere 2000 or so, although the time period escapes my recolection. I'm sure someone can google it up. The cause of the near extinction was suspected to be related to vulcanic activity, possibly in the great rift that appeared across Russia that occurred around the same time period. Also the creationists are not taking into account that biblical civilations did not view time in the same way we do now. A day was considered to be sun up to sun down for instance. As for early writing, it has only recently been discovered that the earliest examples were found in Egypt and predate the Babylonian text by a couple hundred years. In my opinion there are other examples that might represent even earlier primitive attempts at languages expressed in symbols and artwork that are not considered but should be. What I do not understand is how modern knowledge or evolution and issues about time differences could disprove the existence of a God or Goddess or threaten religion. Why would a supreme being hide fossils in the ground to test our faith? That is just plain silly. There are things found in science that are truely awe inspiring and have caused many a scientist to ponder the existence of a God. To see the vast wonder upon wonder that these discoveries bring to us... Should this not make your faith even more secure? EDIT-> Never take a phone call when you are writing a post Ran Man, the Earth's tilt changes every time we get an impact from space or have a huge earthquake. Our magnetic poles even move around from time to time and are not always as they were.
Last edited by GhostwriterDoF; 04/03/06 20:10.
The rivers of time erode away the mountains of existence...
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Re: Science and Creation
[Re: Ran Man]
#68844
04/03/06 20:24
04/03/06 20:24
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Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 4,131
Matt_Aufderheide
Expert
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Expert
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 4,131
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Quote:
Please consider and EXPLAIN the following below!
I want the reasons for the exact seasons that we experience here on earth! Please explain...
Quote:
EARTH'S TILT AND ROTATION
The earth's axis of rotation is tilted 231/2 degrees relative to the perpendicular of the earth's plane of orbit. This tilt causes the four seasons. During the months of May, June, and July the northern hemisphere is pointed toward the sun, causing the hemisphere to warm and bringing on the season called summer. During November, December, and January the northern hemisphere is pointed away from the sun providing colder temperatures and the season called winter. Why is this tilt 231/2 degrees? Why not some other value?
What if the earth had no tilt, and the axis of rotation remained perpendicular to the plane of orbit? We would have no seasons and the surface temperature at any point on the earth would be the same during both July and January. The equatorial region of our planet would be intolerably hot all year and the poles would remain fairly cold. Ice would accumulate at the poles. The weather patterns would be stationary with permanently positioned warm and cold air masses. Some areas would continually be very humid while other areas would be quite arid. Only the mid-latitudes would be comfortable for human habitation and suitable for cultivation. Only about one half of our presently farmable lands could grow crops.
What would be the effect if the earth had double the present tilt? Temperature extremes between seasons would be much more pronounced. Even the mid-latitudes would have unbearable heat in the summer and frigid cold in the winter. Most of Europe and North America would experience very prolonged darkness in the winter and very prolonged daylight in the summer. Life on most of the earth's surface would become intolerable.
http://www.icr.org/index.php?module=articles&action=view&ID=61
If the earth did not have this exact tilt, then life would be very bad for us all. So, why is this happening? Please explain?
This is funny. You reason from 2 false premises, that the Earth's axis is stable and has always been the same, and that climate is directly related to the Earth's axis.
first, the quesiton of the axis:
"the tilt of the Earth's axis to its orbital plane (obliquity of the ecliptic) is currently 66.5 degrees, but this angle has slowly changed over time due to the action of precession"--from Wikipedia.
So the Earth's rotation has shifted over time. Your problem here is ignorance of science and bad logic.
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second, the idea that climate is dependent solely on the axis:
The global climate of the Earth has chnaged radically over history, from being almost toally glaciated (the snowball earth theory), to being almost all tropical (in age of the dinosaurs). The Axis hasnt shifted much in that time, so climate must be related to something else.
Indeed it is: water. The flow of the Earth's oceans regulate the temperature.. this is why you can have palm trees in parts of Ireland. Continental drift has repeatedly altered the flow of the ocean's waters, and having a predictable effect on global climate. Sometimes the poles were frozen as they are now, sometimes they were even temperate.
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Even if the Earth's axis hadn't changed, and was different, life may still have evolved, but it might have turned out somewhat different than it is. For instance, did you know life has been found in both the coldest and hottest parts of the Earth? Things called "archea", for instance, seem to be able to inhabit boiling water, and things live on the freezing poles. Life flourishes at the bottom the sea, in the abyssal plain, a barren, frigid region of total darkness.
Some scientists think there might possibly be life on other worlds, such as Europa or Titan. All you may need for life as we know it is probably some liquid water and otehr elements like carbon.
There might even be some form of life that require neither.. perhaps even silicon life.
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Re: Science and Creation
[Re: Matt_Aufderheide]
#68846
04/03/06 21:25
04/03/06 21:25
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Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 3,682
Coppell, Texas
Ran Man
Expert
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Expert
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 3,682
Coppell, Texas
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The fact is that if not for the tilt of the earth, then most crops and farms would be devastated and mass-starvation would occur due to temperature changes. Things like grapes and apples would be very rare or impossible to find if they did not die out already.  Water supplies in the hot regions would be very scarce. The earth would not be able to sustain life as we know it. This simply points to a "creator" and thus creation. It's not a "chance" scenario as evolutionist say, because the chances of it happening by chance are null. Quote:
Indeed it is: water. The flow of the Earth's oceans regulate the temperature..
I hear they form nice ICE at the north pole? Some regulation, sheesh... 
Last edited by Ran Man; 04/03/06 21:29.
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Re: Science and Creation
[Re: Ran Man]
#68847
04/03/06 22:20
04/03/06 22:20
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 54
AndersA
Junior Member
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Junior Member
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 54
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Quote:
The fact is that if not for the tilt of the earth, then most crops and farms would be devastated and mass-starvation would occur due to temperature changes.
Things like grapes and apples would be very rare or impossible to find if they did not die out already.
Water supplies in the hot regions would be very scarce. The earth would not be able to sustain life as we know it.
Why do you think so?
They say you are very bright so maybe you would like to show us in more detail how you came to these conclusions?
How critical is the tilt angle, for instance. Unless you are just guessing, you obviously have access to an earth climate simulator so maybe you could run a simulation for +-5 degrees tilt. What does it say?
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Re: Science and Creation
[Re: AndersA]
#68848
04/03/06 23:01
04/03/06 23:01
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Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 718
Wisconsin
Irish_Farmer
User
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User
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 718
Wisconsin
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Why are we even bothering with this debate? Its pointless. Matt, or Blatt, I want to see your responses to my lengthy post back there (also JCL and Marco, too). We need to quit running off on these wild goose chases of how important the tilt is. My post is in page 7 of this thread. Check it out.
Besides, the ice of the north pole helps regulate overall tempurature. While the specific conditions for life appearing on accident on earth are beyond comprehendible chance, there's always a rationalization for it: like its just the way it is. We're splitting hairs here. Earth's tilt can't prove God.
I want to hear some discussion. I think my post in page 7 is a good place to start since it gets right to the heart of the problem with evolution.
"The task force finds that...the unborn child is a whole human being from the moment of fertilization, that all abortions terminate the life of a human being, and that the unborn child is a separate human patient under the care of modern medicine."
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Re: Science and Creation
[Re: Irish_Farmer]
#68849
04/03/06 23:31
04/03/06 23:31
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 3,010
analysis paralysis
NITRO777
Expert
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Expert
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 3,010
analysis paralysis
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Im officially sick of the discussion. The evolutionists beat us again, you cant say we didnt try.  There is light at the end of the tunnel though, we cant be wrong about everything! We cant! I want to let you guys know that I have nothing personal against you, even if you think Im dumb and crazy and my whole church is dumb and crazy...its ok, I dont mind if you think that. Are we cool? I hope so  So my fellow crazy Christians, your free to keep on discussing, but Im outta here!!!  Thank you friends & God bless. Im going back into my shell.
Last edited by NITRO777; 04/04/06 00:08.
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Re: Science and Creation
[Re: NITRO777]
#68850
04/03/06 23:34
04/03/06 23:34
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Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 5,181
Austria
Blattsalat
Senior Expert
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Senior Expert
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 5,181
Austria
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@ranman: -->and dear conitec, I want my 3 stars back again!... Your wish was granted from a higher power .... me
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