Why do people::.?

Agreed. Several games have been made with 3dgs.

Maybe you can complain 3dgs isnt' wroth the money, that's fair, but most of them try to compare it to doom 3. and until 3dgs cost in the 1/2millon+ range, they are just showing how stupid they are.

I agree 100% with indiGLOW & FoxHound both!

When somebody doesn't have the patience to learn the tools then if they can't get it on their first try, they're going to give up instantly. It's like some gamers and their video games, if they can't beat a hard level on the first try then they hand the controller to a friend to complete as they go off on a rage. I see that happen a lot around people. When somebody here's something good about 3DGS and it just seems so easy to do, they get their hands on it and can't quite understand how to do a majority of things in the first 24 hours they have it. These are the people who tend not to take the time to go over the MANY tutorials 3DGS offers, who don't take the time to research ANSWERS on the forums you can find everywhere, and who don't even check the Wiki.

I'm sure if those people who give the engine bad reviews took a while longer than they have to actually learn it, then they would have a definite change of heart.

Agreeing with me is always a good thing to do.

Welll... like somebody said.. people dont design their games as often as they should.

They gather up a team of the most skilled individuals money can buy.. but then they wing the game as they go along.

Also, there is this preoccupation with money instead of making the game which would = money if done right. So many people believe they should be contracted and given a signing bonus...not that their time and skill isnt worth anything.. but it certainly isnt unique enough that I am going to pay you astronomical amounts of money that would leave everyone else pretty poor.

I am bad at math but for whatever reason good with graphics.. I would not even try programming in light of that (well actually I did try.. but I never can seem to grasp programming of any kind really).

The engine itself is not a bad tool...not the best but unless you want to spend 10 thousand to 5 million for high end software, I'd suggest you learn to do the best you can.. which judging from most of what I have seen done here, is a far cry from the best this engine is capable of. There is also alot of open source work that can be done to enhance your engine..and alot of times that's what it takes.

I talk to Nadester regularly about his game, Biyu Biyu Rocket..and alot of the things he needed for the game..he wrote into his engine. That's the kind of open heart surgery you have to do sometimes.

Personally, the only reason I'd want to quit on game development is because circumstances just dont seem to agree with me finding a team with which to create... which they dont but I have at least blind faith in the possibility I'll kidnap some people to work for me successfully.. eventually . In the meantime I have design documents from here to Ya-Ya, because I dont want to give up on my work.

Frustration? Maybe they are overwhelmed by the concept of what it really takes to develop a game application? AAA companies have mountains of flops before they get their big sellers.

Lots of people want or even dream of making games. For me it was a small dream but, a dream nonetheless. The reality is it takes a lot of work and different skills to bring it all together. It is also rare, if at all, there are those who can "do it all".

This is why teams are important. If you have GameStudio, then you can work on projects and learn. While you get experience and practice at the skills you enjoy, you can explore other areas of development. If you become very skilled in one or two or more areas, there might even be opportunities to freelance your work for a few coins. Your hobby can pay off in more ways than one, if you are dedicated.

Today I was browsing through the manual and saw it has a lot of good information to START with, including a little intoduction to trigonomatry. This however is a GameStudio A6 engine manual and not an encyclopedia of 3D graphics.

To "Know your Reference" means that you must get more books or digital reference material. Get as much material as you can to support the environment, and the manual. Take your time, browse through it to "know where to look" when the need arises.

Having the tools is nice, having the drive to do something with them is something else. I'm thankful for what I have, and will make the most of it as I am able Thanks again Conitec!

Thanks all

However I dont' think I made myself understood
Well,may be there is not a real answer to my question
I dont care if Mr x claims that Torque is better while mr Y supports 3dsg
That's life
I am an hobbyest game programmer , the most important issues for me are :

stability and ease of use.

I am not intersted in super advanced features or super fast rendering which I will never take advantage of
I dont want to design Doom 3 but a complete "low level " game, yes I do
The point is that no other engines receives so harsh critics
I was going to quote some of them but I thought it is not fair
Summing up , they claim ;

"Ok you can easly code a demo or a fragment of game , but if you want to put the pieces togheter , then 3dsg let you down "

To date, I made "fragments of game" only and I must say that 3dsg is the best engine I have ever tried ( out of 4)
However I am scared for the future...

I still find that funny that some think you can't finish a game. How about the driving simulator. A huge game with a c-script physic engine.

My personal opinion, is that 3dgs is ideal for the 3d casual game market. Two examples of this are my own Tower and Xcube 2. With some scripting knwoledge, and following a modeling tutorial or two, a single person can put together one of these games fairly quickly.

And while I obviously don't have proof, I'm a firm believer that games like Thief, and Morrowind, can be made with 3dGS. It just takes TIME. Seems alot of people want to be able to crank out games twice a year. Making games (especially if you are going at it alone), is time consuming.

I think so too laethyn, the A6 engine would be suitable to run those type of games. Of course Elderscrolls III had 2000 Npcs and hundreds of places to explore and treasures to find. Planning alone for such a game would take months.

Alberto, I thought that other communities were same as here
Weird. Maybe it is too open an engine for some users? You are
probably right, no real answer to your question...

FoxHound's game is a real game application. Imagine what two FoxHounds could accomplish. Or a two headed FoxHound?

Two of me? We would just argue over who was more evil. Then get in an orphan sacrafcing contest then things might get out of hand, wake up the next morning and have to hitch hike back from Vega in a Cha Cha dress ... again.

I think most people here have dillusions of granduer, and maybe I am among them

It is amazing how much work is involved in even the simplest tasks: an example.

We recently set about rendering a 5 min short film. Each frame of the film was a composite of at least 3 images, and at 30 frames a second this was 9000 images x number of composites per frame, in this case 27000 images.

Each image was 800x600 and approx 1-2Mb each. So we needed 27gig of file space for 5 minutes of film. Not to bad, but then each frame took 45 seconds to render, 1,215,000 seconds or approx 14 days.

So from what seemed like a small task quickly grew out of expected proportions.

Now try and apply this to making an entire game. Simeply planning to a level that the development of the project can start takes a huge effort. Most people don't want to do that, they just want to make a game

But in most cases, without this document investment for your project, it is likely to fail.

Quid Pro Quo: most ambitious projects, the next doom3 for example, never see the light of day. That's not to say A6 is flawed, my first comment post explains it best I think

Just my 2 cents...

Of course you can make a complete, polished, high-quality game using 3DGS. If few poeple have really done so it's because it takes a huge amount of effort and planning to make anything more complicated than 3d pong, talent, and generally requires money. What you get are a lot of unfinished projects, and a few valueware-quality titles that arent particularly interesting. This is the cold, hard truth of indy game devlopment: most projects will fail.

But in reality, there arent many good, finished games using most of these other indy engines either. Name a good Torque game, Dark basic, BlitzBasic , Ogre, Jamagic, or Irlicht. I can think of maybe 1 or 2.

As far as people "just wanting to make games", I personally, don't go about any sort of project like this without a full design document and/or tech document and/or art bible.

It's simply a matter of who the builder is, and how devoted you are to your project.