New energy source?

Posted By: Joozey

New energy source? - 11/16/06 13:48

Ok I was wondering the following:

If you are in open space, zero-gravity, and spin an object around, it would spin practically forever right? So, if you take a magnet for the spinning object, and wind a reel (copper wire) around the magnet, and spin the magnet very fast, there will be electricity generated if I am correct. Wouldn't you get an 'infinite' amount of power? I don't know how much power this can give, but I think this would be a very good replacement for the expensive and vulnerable solar panels used for satelites and spaceships.
Posted By: fogman

Re: New energy source? - 11/16/06 14:13

The magnetical (is that right spelled?) and the electrical field would stop the ensemble. Because you loose the friction in space, but not the fundamental physics.
The energy will be transformed to other forms. So after all there wonīt be any kinematic energy.

I should not try to be a smart ass in english...

However you are right that this system can save a lot of energy. Take for example vehicles like these:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gyrobus
Posted By: Joozey

Re: New energy source? - 11/16/06 14:31

So they have much more benefits than solar panels
Maybe a good thing to propose to NASA
Posted By: Damocles

Re: New energy source? - 11/16/06 15:55

The spinning thing would have a "magnetic" frition, just like
any Electic-Dynamo.
So it would rotate as fast as the the outer ring after a while.

You cant create energy out of nothing, just convert it.
(except you find a way to create matter and antimatter out of nothing and seperate them )
Posted By: Joozey

Re: New energy source? - 11/16/06 16:04

Well maybe if you can drain energy from gravity somehow, like throw a magnet in an orbit around the earth, through a big reel tunnel

I know you can not create energy out of nothing, but maybe you can with a starting amount of energy create more and efficient energy with the use of nature, like magnetfields, heat, light and gravity. But yeah since magnetfields give friction to the flying object, you will still loose energy, I understand.
Posted By: EX Citer

Re: New energy source? - 11/16/06 19:33

The magnet in the orbit will be stopped as well.

Energie is simple. The energie you put in you will get out. Now remember that!

If you raise a stone for two meters. You put potential energie into the stone. When you release the stone, he will produce the same amount energy when he drops and collides with the ground (position change (movement), heat and deforming) as you put into lifting the stone (you need also energie to bring your arm into that position).
Posted By: Joozey

Re: New energy source? - 11/16/06 20:13

But there are most certainly other ways to get energy, by using natures forces, I was searching for one, but I didn't realise magnet fields give friction as well. Solar panels, antimatter, waterforce, windforce, you name it, there are plenty things that already exist which gain energy other than energy only you put in. They just might not be the most efficient ways, and maybe there's a better one.
Posted By: Damocles

Re: New energy source? - 11/16/06 21:09

If you have 2 black holes rotating close to each other around each other,
there might be the possibility, that (by quantum effects)
engergy is beeing produced out of nothing!,
This is by seperating antimappter and matter quants.
These quants can emerge out of nothing, but anihilate right after they emerged.
The gravitational field could seperate this matter-antimatter couple,
creating energy(mass) out of nothing.

i am not totally shure about this thing,
but it would be the only way to create energy out of nothing,

Other ways of creating perpetuum-mobile do not exist.
it is all about transforming energy/mass to other forms.

The only thing that created big amounts of energy out of "nothing"
i know was the big bang.

A good way to produce energy is nuclear fusion,
melting hydrogen into helium.
Probably the energy source for the 2nd half og the 21rst centauri.
Posted By: AlbertoT

Re: New energy source? - 11/16/06 22:15

The magnetic field generated by the current induce parassite currents into the spinning magnet with the result of slowing down the magnet
By the way, this is the reason why the magnet are made of thin slices rather than a whole block
You nust try to open these circuits inside the magnet otherwise no electrical engine can work
Posted By: fogman

Re: New energy source? - 11/16/06 22:27

Quote:

But there are most certainly other ways to get energy, by using natures forces, I was searching for one, but I didn't realise magnet fields give friction as well. Solar panels, antimatter, waterforce, windforce, you name it, there are plenty things that already exist which gain energy other than energy only you put in. They just might not be the most efficient ways, and maybe there's a better one.




Solar panels, water + windforce get there energy from, as youīve said, nature forces. But where come these forces from? Not out of nothing.
The sun for example will be burnt out in a few million years. Then there wonīt be any energy transformed (not generated, because the sun donīt generate energy!) by the sun.
Posted By: PHeMoX

Re: New energy source? - 11/17/06 02:07

If I understand correctly, the sun is simply burning it's nuclear fuel, right? Meaning it'll stop generating (burning and thus producing) energy eventually. but after quite some time. This might be a problem, but most probably not a problem for mankind. We'd be the species living the longest of all if we'd witniss that moment in time I think.

Edit: Aah, yes, you are right Fogman.

Cheers
Posted By: fogman

Re: New energy source? - 11/17/06 12:36

Quote:

...burning and thus producing...



Not producing. It transforms (burns) his saved energy. There canīt be energy produced out of nothing.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sun#Life_cycle
Posted By: Joozey

Re: New energy source? - 11/17/06 20:28

But the transformed energy is not lost, there will never be more and never be less energy than the current amount, so I believe there is a certain constant of the amount of energy. I was not searching for a way to create more energy, but rather a way to gain more and efficient energy than the current methods.

The method I discribed in my first post would substract it's energy from the magnetic force. Eventually the magnet field will fade and the energy transformation will stop, however since not only the magnetic field's energy is used for electric energy, but also friction (despite the zero-gravity), it's not an efficient way. You'd constantly need to rotate the magnet again, so it is certainly not convenient for satelites to use.

In the other energy post Matt discribed a theory to drain energy from gravity, and maybe somehow there is a way with this theory to do so, but it should cost some energy from another form. The point is here, to search for an energy form useless for human kind but can be used in the progress to convert to another type which IS usefull for us.
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